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#148861 - 09/13/09 03:34 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Chess Fan]
Chess Fan Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 10/17/03
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: Chess Fan
Here is the first part of a two-part article series by Joseph Chambers: -- "Islamic Radicals & God's Solution."

And, here is the second, (and final part), of this two article series: -- "Islamic Religion Utterly Destroyed."


Chess Fan
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#148863 - 09/13/09 05:55 PM Re: World Religions [Re: PircAlert]
spock Offline
Ninja

Registered: 06/02/03
Loc: South Dakota, USA
Originally Posted By: PircAlert
Refuting irreducible complexity is another funny thing. So natural selection was trying to create a mousetrap but failed to accomplish that and in that process it could only put together the clip and it became a tie clip?? Mouse trap is designed and created for a purpose! And tie clip is designed and created for entirely different purpose!!


How interesting. This is exactly the type of reasoning mistake mentioned in both Supersense and in Darwin's Gift: To Science and Religion .

Pirc, if you have a legitimate desire to pursue real knowledge Darwin's Gift is written by a priest and provides a nice moderate Christian perspective on evolution. If you prefer a more fundamentalist perspective, you can try Thank God for Evolution.

The bottom line is that many, many theological scholars are comfortable with evolution and recognize that the evolution is a positive contribution to theology and Christian belief.
_________________________
When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?
--John Maynard Keynes

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#148864 - 09/13/09 06:09 PM Re: World Religions [Re: PircAlert]
Ken Offline
Ninja

Registered: 02/01/05
Loc: Canada
Quote:
So I think we can't read too much from this trial.
The one thing you can read is ID is not science. The second thing is that ID is just creationism in different clothes, and thus a religion and therefore an infringement on the 1987 ruling. The third thing is that evolution is science. From the theory comes predictions and these predictions were borne out.

Read more on the chimp-human chromosome. As I said, crushing argument based on a prediction based on evolutionary theory.

The fish-amphibian transitional fossil was another prediction. Fish fossils are found in layers about 380 mill. years old. Amphibians are found in layers about 360 mill. years old. Therefore, Dr. Neil Shubin said "We should be able to find a fossil that has characteristics of both if we look in layers that are about 370 mill. years old.

They checked their geological maps, and found that a layer of the right age and right type (sedimentary) was exposed in the Canadian Arctic on Ellesmere Island. They flew in, did some exploration and there it was, Tiktaalik, a great example of a transitional form right where it was predicted to be.

I see you haven't read that article on a Christian response to radioactive dating techniques as you're still confused on the issue.

Note this though. If dating techniques were unreliable or wrong then Dr. Shubin would not have been able to correctly identify which layer of rock he needed. It would have been a needle in a earth-sized haystack. He didn't find Tiktaalik and decide the rocks must be between 380 and 360 because Tiktaalik looked like it fit in between fish and amphibians. Instead evolutionary theory and radioactive dating pointed him to the right aged rocks he needed to check.

This is not an isolated incident either. We now have hundreds of transitional species from land mammals to whales, from reptiles to mammals (some are so transitional they're not sure if they're mammals or reptiles), from dinosaurs to birds. We have many feathered or partly feathered dinosaurs now.

Many of these aren't found by random digging in the dirt, but are found because radioactive dating tells them which layers to check. If you want to look for dinosaur-bird transitions, check rocks of this age. You want land to aquatic mammal transitions, check rocks of that age, etc.

As I've said many times these things are not just backed up with one bit of evidence, but from multiple lines of (independent) evidence all saying the same thing. And the fact that it successfully tells us where to look to find the fossils we want is even more evidence (on top of all the other evidence) that radioactive dating works.

Evolution is confirmed by the fossil record, by geology and stratification, by cell biology, by molecular biology, by anatomy, by genetics (including mtDNA and insertion points of endogenous retroviruses).

Pretend no fossils had ever been found, and any one of the other areas by themselves would still lead scientists to propose common descent. Any one of those disciplines could have toppled evolution if they provided radically different answers. They didn't. Instead they spectacularly confirm it, and continue to confirm it.
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Accomplishing the impossible means only that the boss will add it to your regular duties.--Doug Larson

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#148865 - 09/13/09 06:11 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Ken]
Ken Offline
Ninja

Registered: 02/01/05
Loc: Canada

If Darwin was fundamentally wrong about common descent then all those other techniques would be giving us widely different answers. The fact that they all point to the same answer is indicative that it is the right answer.

All your objections have already been dealt with many times. If you are serious about finding answers to your questions, start here.

Re: Irreducible complexity. Behe's examples (blood-clotting proteins, bacteria flagellum) which he claimed were irreducibly complex were shown to be irreducible after all. You could take away some of the parts and they would still function although with a different function. And those could be reduced even further. The concept of IC has been disproved and if Behe wants to keep using it he will need to revamp it.

See this video. The IC part starts at Number 22. Bacteria flagella: Not irreducibly complex. Dr. Miller gives a good explanation of it. Note that evolutionary theory makes a prediction, and prediction allows it to be tested (see his talk about minute 48).
_________________________
Accomplishing the impossible means only that the boss will add it to your regular duties.--Doug Larson

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#148866 - 09/13/09 07:20 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Ken]
Ed Yetman, III Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 12/08/04
Loc: Tucson, Arizona
PA, you write about why something is designed. Can you show us the reason for any living being to exist?
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Ed Yetman, III
YetmanBrothers.com

"I will not be pushed, passed, isolated, blockaded, doubled, undoubled, or promoted!"--The Pawn.

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#148867 - 09/13/09 08:07 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Ed Yetman, III]
Chess Fan Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 10/17/03
Loc: Pennsylvania
Here once again is Pastor Loran Livingston of The Central Church of God in Charlotte, North Carolina preaching a message from the Word of Almighty God at this morning's, (Sunday, September 13th, 2009), morning service.

Pastor Livingston is preaching on the topic of "deception", and, the main Bible text that he uses for this message is from The Book of 2nd Thessalonians, Chapter 2, Verses 1 through 10.


Chess Fan
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**Everyone, please feel free to click on to, and, to read: -- "My End Times Blog" **

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#148881 - 09/14/09 01:09 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Chess Fan]
Chess Fan Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 10/17/03
Loc: Pennsylvania
Here is the September 14th, 2009 edition of the Rapture Ready website's weekly newsletter, which is titled: -- "Nearing Midnight."


Chess Fan
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**Everyone, please feel free to click on to, and, to read: -- "My End Times Blog" **

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#148882 - 09/14/09 01:13 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Chess Fan]
Chess Fan Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 10/17/03
Loc: Pennsylvania
And, here is the September 14th, 2009 edition of the Rapture Ready website's weekly newsletter, which is titled: -- "Israel Watch."


Chess Fan
_________________________
**Everyone, please feel free to click on to, and, to read: -- "My End Times Blog" **

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#148885 - 09/14/09 02:47 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Ed Yetman, III]
Petrosianic Online   happy
Ninja

Registered: 08/31/04
Loc: Doo-Wah-Diddy, Mississippi
*

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#148887 - 09/14/09 04:48 PM Re: World Religions [Re: Petrosianic]
Ed Yetman, III Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 12/08/04
Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Originally Posted By: Petrosianic
*


**
_________________________
Ed Yetman, III
YetmanBrothers.com

"I will not be pushed, passed, isolated, blockaded, doubled, undoubled, or promoted!"--The Pawn.

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