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#62836 - 08/07/08 05:08 PM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
Mohan Offline
Member

Registered: 05/13/07
Loc: Chennai
Steinitz’s Legacy = Play anybody to prove himself the Champion.

Laskar’s Legacy= End Steinitz’s legacy. Risk your title only when you are in dire need of money.

Capa’s Legacy = End Laskar’s legacy (he had enough money!) Play the one who is deceptively inferior.

Alekine's Legacy = End Capa’s Legacy. Play the ones who are really inferior.

Fide Legacy= End all prior legacies Set proper road to Championship with Chances for all with proper Qualification cycle.

Kasparov Legacy= End Fide Legacy (for More money)Pretend to inherit Steinitz legacy from its coffin.

Kramnik’s Legacy = End Kasparov Legacy. Run away from the Strongest to "set things right". Stake the title to set his position right;but cry over the spilt milk that all is not alright.

Anand’s Legacy=Just play Chess against anybody as it comes. Accept the results and title as they come. Claimb the ladder to be no one. Stil claim no legacy for braking of any legacy.

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#62837 - 08/07/08 07:21 PM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
PircAlert Moderator Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 08/01/04
Loc: USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Russianbear:
Quote:
Originally posted by PircAlert:
I disagree with RussianBear! You don't play the "best" move always.
Maybe YOU don't. :rolleyes:
See, the truth is, WE don't. smile That is a different issue. We are not talking about us here. We are talking about super GMs who knowingly makes that choice of the "practical" move in place of the "best" move. Kogi has neatly provided us an example for that.
_________________________
Men make counterfeit money; in many more cases, money makes counterfeit men (read world champions!)

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#62838 - 08/07/08 07:49 PM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
PircAlert Moderator Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 08/01/04
Loc: USA
Quote:
Originally posted by knight_tour:
Quote:
Originally posted by PircAlert:
The best chess player, I would think, is the one who calculates more than anyone else in a given new position.
I'm not so sure. Often yes, but sometimes I think the best player is the one whose intuition steers them better!
I think I agree with you. I think you need both intuition and calculating ability. The intuition you need for seeing (calculating) many things, while the calculating ability you need for seeing deeper things. In case of Anand I think he sees the most variations but sometimes he doesn't strain himself to go deeper unless the position required it. In contrast Kramnik like players would pick a few variations and try to go deeper to find the truth, while Anand would simply pick another variation and would go up on the clock!! The more the complications, the better for Anand.
_________________________
Men make counterfeit money; in many more cases, money makes counterfeit men (read world champions!)

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#62839 - 08/08/08 12:55 AM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
niceforkinmove Offline
Ninja

Registered: 02/24/03
Loc: Bloomington
Quote:
Originally posted by Russianbear:
Quote:
Originally posted by PircAlert:
I disagree with RussianBear! You don't play the "best" move always.
Maybe YOU don't. :rolleyes:
Quote:


You play the "practical" move!
Is it possible you only play the "practical" move because you think it offers you the best chances? So in a way, don't you play the best move when you play what you think is the most practical one?
Ok
If we agree that a checkmate in 10 is better than a checkmate in 25 we have easy examples. Lets say each side has a queen 6 pawns and two bishops and a rook. You see your opponent hung his queen which you could take with check. Since you can take it with check it is easy to see you can then trade down the other major pieces and then use your queen to pick off his pawns very easilly. However you are also considering this very very tricky and long check mate pattern that involves sacrificing your queen and leads to check mate in 10 moves.

I think most people would say the checkmate is the better move but taking the queen and trading down is the more practical attempt.

I think there is a point when a game is totally winning that all players do not get too concerned with which is the best - shortest way to victory but instead which is the easiest and most practical.
_________________________
I have pondered the wisdom of the sages. I see now I have slain without knowledge of what to do rightly. But what care I for such men?--Genghis Khan

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#62840 - 08/08/08 01:41 AM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
PircAlert Moderator Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 08/01/04
Loc: USA
NFM,
I think most of the times people would resign when you take the practical route. The position would get simplified. If you go the "best" route, there is good chances your opponent would wait. There is a possibility for miscalculation and your opponent is not entirely left with no chances.

I think what RB is trying to confuse us is, he is now saying the practical move is the best move, not the best move is the best move?? smile
_________________________
Men make counterfeit money; in many more cases, money makes counterfeit men (read world champions!)

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#62841 - 08/08/08 02:46 AM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
proloy Online   content
Ninja

Registered: 03/20/03
Loc: Hyderabad
Quote:
Originally posted by Mohan:
Steinitz's Legacy = Play anybody to prove himself the Champion.

Anand's Legacy=Just play Chess against anybody as it comes. Accept the results and title as they come. Claimb the ladder to be no one. Stil claim no legacy for braking of any legacy.
So this means things have come a full circle, and Anand has restored Steinitz's legacy!
_________________________
The fellow who thinks he knows it all is especially annoying to those of us who do.

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#62842 - 08/08/08 03:35 AM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
gambit Offline
Queen

Registered: 01/30/03
Loc: zimbabwe
I still wish for the "old " candidate matches system, it was before my time, but I simply relish recalling the grt games btn fischer and his candidate opponents, same for all the rest, portitch,ivkov,petrosian etc.... a truly glorious time ......
then all these "petty" aurguments as to who is better could be done with. :-)
_________________________
All Idealism is falsehood in the face of necessity - Nietzsche

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#62843 - 08/08/08 09:24 AM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
knight_tour Offline
Member

Registered: 02/15/05
Loc: Reykjavik, Iceland
Quote:
Originally posted by proloy:
So this means things have come a full circle, and Anand has restored Steinitz's legacy!
What do you mean? Anand has never won a world championship match. Steinitz did.
_________________________
"Whenever you find that you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect."
- Mark Twain

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#62844 - 08/08/08 03:08 PM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
Petrosianic Offline
Ninja

Registered: 08/31/04
Loc: Doo-Wah-Diddy, Mississippi
Quote:
Originally posted by Mohan:

Anand’s Legacy=Just play Chess against anybody as it comes. Accept the results and title as they come. Claimb the ladder to be no one. Stil claim no legacy for braking of any legacy.
Mohan's Legacy: Possess a pathological aversion to spelling, grammar and fact checkers.
_________________________
"I brought the Atom Bomb. I think it's a good time to use it." -- Dr. Richard Gordon, King Dinosaur

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#62845 - 08/10/08 11:40 PM Re: Latest Kramnik interview
Kogi Kaishakunin Offline
Queen

Registered: 03/19/03
Loc: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Quote:
Originally posted by gambit:
I still wish for the "old " candidate matches system, it was before my time, but I simply relish recalling the grt games btn fischer and his candidate opponents, same for all the rest, portitch,ivkov,petrosian etc.... a truly glorious time ......
then all these "petty" aurguments as to who is better could be done with. :-)
This perhaps merits its own thread. smile

I've been reading Kasparov's "My Great Predecessors", which is a tremendous series of books. I sincerely recommend them to any ardent chess players and enthusiast.

We've discussed much about FIDE and their current structures to filter candidates to the World Championship Title. The KOs (World Cup), the past candidates matches, the new series of events, etc.

I guess there's many people supporting the past Candidates matches. I was quite surprised to read in Kasparov's fifth book the method for the 1975 match.

Karpov begins playing against Poluga. The first three games ended in draws, and in his book, Kasparov writes "By the new FIDE rules, adopted under the influence of Fischer, they now played to a definite number of wins; in the quarter-final - to three (but not more than 16 games)" (page 231).

Karpov beats Poluga 3 wins to nil, and he goes on to face Spassky. Kasparov writes: "They played up to four wins, but with a limit of 20 games" (page 248).

Karpov is again victorious, this time by 4 wins to 1. So on he goes to face Korchnoi. And what was the requirement in the Candidates Final? Kasparov writes: "The Karpov-Korchnoi match (Moscow, autumn 1974), which effectively became a clash for teh world championship, was played to five wins by one of the participants, but with a limit of 24 games (...)" (page 285).

Oh the good old times! Since then, not only the candidates stage has suffered many changes, but also the Final stage has mutated! In 1973-74 the Candidates stage was played with 16, 20 and 24 games limits, whilst in recent years, we've had WC Finals to 24 games, then to 20 games (Kasparov-Anand 1995 and Karpov-Kamsky 1996), to 6 games(!) (Karpov-Anand 1998; Khalifman-Akopian 1999; Anand-Shirov 2000), to 16 games (Kramnik-Kasparov 2000), to 8 games (Ponomariov-Ivanchuk 2001), to 14 games (Kramnik-Lékó 2004), back to 6 games (Kasimdzhanov-Adams 2004), then to a 14-game tournament (Topalov 2005), then to a 12-game match (Kramnik-Topalov 2006), back to a 14-game tournament (Anand 2007), then to a 12-game match (Anand-Kramnik 2008).

What a mess FIDE's created... :rolleyes:
_________________________
Life is like the game RISK and my secret mission card says "Destroy the World".

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