Mig Greengard's ChessNinja.com
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October 13, 2006

KKRRRRrrrrrramnik Wins!

Sorry, you might not really appreciate the title if you're not a NY Yankees fan. But you get the point. Vladimir Kramnik defeated Veselin Topalov – twice – to become the first unified world chess champion since Garry Kasparov in 1993. Kramnik won rapid games 2 and 4 to take the tiebreaker 2.5-1.5, ending any controversy about forfeits and plumbing and protests. The lawyers will have to sheathe their quills for a little while, at least.

I wouldn't go as far as saying Kramnik played the better chess in the match. He won the first two games in rather fortuitous fashion. But these matches are always about nerves and Topalov was obviously jittery at the start. They both played mediocre defense in the second half. Topalov scored two wins with remarkable ease before being blown away himself in game 10. Of course it had to go to tiebreaks, just out of sheer obstinancy. Kramnik dominated the rapid set. He was overpowering with white and had superior positions early with black in the other two games. Nerves? Karma? Justice? My prediction that he would win the tiebreak? Who knows?

I don't know if the better player won today. But looking back over the past few weeks I'd have to say that the better man certainly did. Hail the new and improved world champion! Or, dare I type it, hail the new World Champion!

Anyone else ever beaten the clear world #1 in match play twice in a lifetime? Mebbe Botvinnik's rematch wins over Smyslov and Tal? Anyway, phenomenal achievement.

Posted at 11:29 | Permanent link | Tags: hurray, Kramnik, rapid, tiebreaks, Topalov, WCh 06
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Comments

Mig (and Mark C),

How were your hits, unique logins, posters etc for San Luis vs Elista? I'm guessing (and hoping) the match was better.

Posted by: al at October 13, 2006 11:50

Thank you Mig for an excellent venue during the match. Very educational, entertaining and enlightening! Long live the Royal Game of Chess! Are we ready for a Kasparovistic comeback? Yes!

Posted by: OneSong at October 13, 2006 11:50

Thank you Mig for an excellent venue during the match. Very educational, entertaining and enlightening! Long live the Royal Game of Chess! Are we ready for a Kasparovistic comeback? Yes!

Posted by: OneSong at October 13, 2006 11:50

Indeed, this is a good time for a "hurray" tag.

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 11:52

Now Mr. K brings on another computer vs man match. That should get a lot of chess publicity.

RUSTY

Posted by: Russell Miller at October 13, 2006 11:54

Thanks for the great venue Mig. Educational, Entertaining and Enlightening. Long Live The Royal Game of Chess! Are we ready for a Kasparovistic comback? Yes!

Posted by: OneSong at October 13, 2006 11:54

Well, I would say Kramnik played the better chess in the match. But I have better things to do right now than arguing that ;-) Hurrah for Kramnik! A well-deserved win in so many ways.

Posted by: acirce at October 13, 2006 11:56

Kramnik wins the so-called FIDÉ World Championship here. He defends the real title. Both were on the line, but one remains utterly worthless. The only hope is that Kramnik will use his position to make FIDÉ stop this stupid tournament nonsense, stop the KOs, stop the crap. We need real matches, hopefully 24 games. That's what it's all about. Until FIDÉ does the right thing (unlikely with Ilyumzhanov in charge), its "title" is nothing.

The ultimate goal should be to restore control of the crown to FIDÉ, of course, but as it is they would just throw it in a closet and forget about it. This is when I wish ghosts were real, Steinitz could come back and murder all those FIDÉ idiots for all this destructive nonsense.

Time for real chess, and real championships. That means, time for someone else to come forward to challenge Kramnik and seize the sceptre.

Posted by: Joshua B. Lilly at October 13, 2006 11:57

Hmm, my "per definition" disappeared above as I put it between brackets... "per definition played the better chess.." anyway.. nevermind that.

Posted by: acirce at October 13, 2006 11:57

Amazing several weeks of chess, full of excitment and drama... I'm glad that there is a Unified Champion, and really hope Kramnik plays more often and doesn't just disappear again. In terms of play... I think Topalov is the stronger player, and Kramnik got lucky in this one, but that's life and sports, the better player or team doesn't always win.

Wouldn't be surprised if Topalov does indeed play in Mexico City, wins, and we have Kramnik-Topa Part 2.

Posted by: Zaur at October 13, 2006 11:57

Hey mig, maybe the Yankees announcer was there with the announcement. Doesn't seem to have anything else to do since last week...

Posted by: JIm Bartle at October 13, 2006 11:58

Ability to play well in the face of great pressure, come up with sound decisions in limited time, with the eyes of the world on you and not commit any blunders is one of the essential characteristics of a great champion. If it wasn't, Vesselin would be the champ right now. Congratulations to Kramnik on his terrific play and accomplishments.

And thanks to Mig for creating the best chess community online.

Posted by: Yuriy Kleyner at October 13, 2006 11:58

Amazing several weeks of chess, full of excitment and drama... I'm glad that there is a Unified Champion, and really hope Kramnik plays more often and doesn't just disappear again. In terms of play... I think Topalov is the stronger player, and Kramnik got lucky in this one, but that's life and sports, the better player or team doesn't always win.

Wouldn't be surprised if Topalov does indeed play in Mexico City, wins, and we have Kramnik-Topa Part 2.

Posted by: Zaur at October 13, 2006 11:58

Mig,s what's Garry's reaction to the games and to the result?

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 12:01

I bet a Kramnik-Kasparov match, with a Unified Champion, would get huge sponsors... not 1million prize fund... but more like $5 million a piece... that would bring Kasparov out of retirement... Kasparov is the best.

Posted by: Zaur at October 13, 2006 12:02

Is that justice I smell?

Posted by: David Graham at October 13, 2006 12:04

Joining the chorus of thanks to Mig for incredible coverage! Without this site and Susan Polgar's, I for one would certainly have turned my back on chess as a sport during this match, and that probably goes for a lot of people.

Posted by: Sirocco at October 13, 2006 12:05

My traffic here was around 40% higher than San Luis. But since my 2006 traffic was already significantly higher than 2005, it needs to be corrected. Every day since the match began, my traffic was roughly three time my daily average and double the last few event daily averages. San Luis was never double, say, Linares, but it was over 50% higher, quite a spike. But nothing close to the relative leap from Elista. The bizarre thing to me is that my traffic numbers, as judged by a few vaguely accurate online trackers, is similar to that of TWIC and much better than that of ChessCafe. And they PAY people and have that wacky revenue thing, being the two largest online chess shops. Shows the power of community and my total disregard for my children's inheritance. Anyway, thanks to those who clicked the "donate" button, and a tiny bit less thanks to those who didn't! Nice having you around anyway.

Other than traffic, I'm also getting a lot more calls from mainstream media people who find this site looking for information. I've done three radio bits in the past week and will do BBC/NPR later today, so they tell me. Sadly, I doubt that would have happened without BladderGate and the forfeit. Good or bad, dunno.

No worries about MY server. The message boards hog CPU power but not really bandwidth. But I'm hosted on Pair and they have fat pipe. Pair rocks.

Posted by: Mig at October 13, 2006 12:08

Joshua Lilly : I agree.
Styles: Danailov's crap distracted from the chess - which was a very interesting study in contrasting styles. Topalov's aggression had the potential to break Kramnik's over-prophylaxis several times, but Kramnik was also able to expose his unsoundness at times. A rapid finale to a WC match doesn't make sense, but it was fun to watch, anyway.

Posted by: FrankM at October 13, 2006 12:10

"I don't know if the better player won today. "

That is a very unfair comment.
Chess is first of all a struggle (viva Lasker).
The chess player is a combination of a zillion things.
Kramnik won, at the board.
Whether that was because he was a better fighter, or because of his superior understanding of the game, or because of any other reason u may choose to use,
the man deserves the applause of the world for winning.
And has certainly proved himself the better "player"

Posted by: sartaj hans at October 13, 2006 12:11

By the way, how about I show all these traffic numbers, and those of ChessBase, to the Mexico guys and suggest they cut the tournament prize fund in half, swap Topalov in for Kramnik, and use the other half of the prize fund ($650K) for a WCh match of 18 games in November? Too little cash? I can only think of, oh, just about everyone but the fans finding lots of reasons to disagree...

Posted by: Mig at October 13, 2006 12:11

"I don't know if the better player won today. "

That is a very unfair comment.
Chess is first of all a struggle (viva Lasker).
The chess player is a combination of a zillion things.
Kramnik won, at the board.
Whether that was because he was a better fighter, or because of his superior understanding of the game, or because of any other reason u may choose to use,
the man deserves the applause of the world for winning.
And has certainly proved himself the better "player"

Posted by: sartaj hans at October 13, 2006 12:12

"I’d rather blunder a queen or a mate in one than appear in the situation of Leko in 2004. He did not yield to Kramnik two years ago, but Leko is nobody now, and Kramnik is a world champion."

I mean, C'mon. If this guy is calling Leko a "nobody" then he can make up for all the mud he and his team have produced in the last few weeks all he wants - but he still is an a**hole...

Posted by: Albrecht von der Lieth at October 13, 2006 12:13

I'd like to go back to Interzonals and candidate matches, with WC matches every other year. Either that or just do away with WC title and go to golf/tennis-style rankings with only four major and numerous minor tournaments.

Posted by: noyb at October 13, 2006 12:15

Oh, don't nitpick, sartaj, we know who won the match. But chess is a science as well as a sport. We can't call it luck because of that, but we can also see when someone was fortunate and admit that too. I'm not taking anything away from Kramnik at all to say his play was far from perfect. I'm sure he'd say the same.

Posted by: Mig at October 13, 2006 12:15

Go for it, Mig, I’d say.

My, but I’d like to see the contract between your boys and FIDE. Given the balls-up FIDE are making of attempting to produce the field for Mexico…….

I wonder what Kramnik’s going to do when FIDE tell him they’ve decided to invite Topalov after all?

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 12:18

Not sure if anyone has mentioned it, but Kramnik has twice now defeated the clear world #1 in match play. (The hedge that this match was actually drawn is counter-hedged by one loss being a forfeit.) Anyone else ever done that before? I can only imagine it might have been possible for Botvinnik's match wins over Tal and Smyslov being in the neighborhood.

Posted by: Mig at October 13, 2006 12:19

Does anyone know if Kramnik considers himself to be the holder of 2 separate titles or 1 unified title now?

2 different scenarios next year in Mexico:

(1) Anand wins the tournament and in the process beats Kramnik (2-0).
(2) Anand wins the tournament and in the process loses to Kramnik (0-2 or 0.5-1.5) and Kramnik otherwise has a solid plus score (and no losses).

It seems to me (in the second scenario, but probably not the first) that the precedent Kramnik took by ignoring San Luis (and hasn't that paid off for him!!) would allow him still to consider himself the Classical (or Matchplay) Champion.

Posted by: Stuart at October 13, 2006 12:22

Hi Mig, my compliments for running a very good website, also during this WC(C).

Actually, Kramnik beat Topalov twice now (classical and rapid) so one could argue he beat the #1 three times ;-).
Hopefully Kramnik can keep it up and reach the #1 spot himself. Would be deserved IMHO.

Posted by: Marvol at October 13, 2006 12:24

Topalov should take Kramnik's spot in the Mexico tournament and the winner should play a match with Kramnik.

Just curious, but will Radjabov challenge Kramnik to a match in 2007 now that he is FIDE champion?

Curt Collyer

Posted by: Collyeratis at October 13, 2006 12:26

Even if one wanted to sympathize with Topalov, he makes it impossible. I wish he would just shut up. He is (was) playing Kramnik, not Leko, so why attack Leko? Calling Leko a nobody is absolutely ridiculous. At least Leko drew a match with Kramnik without getting free points and without off-board dirty tricks and accusations.

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 12:26

"I don't know if the better player won today. But looking back over the past few weeks I'd have to say that the better man certainly did."

If, for Kasparov2000, Topalov, and Kramnik you could somehow remove the "chess calculator" part of their brains and compare them, Kramnik's might well finish last. [who the hell am I to judge?]

But Kramnik's brain is connected up to a strikingly well-balanced personality. Hard to imagine him throwing tantrums. Hard to imagine him tolerating a manager like Danailov.

These days top GMs are so well prepared and so technically proficient that it seems like the only way they're ever going to lose is by a blunder. In such an environment the man with the cooler head has a distinct advantage.

Kramnik may not be the best chessplayer, but over the past three WCC matches he's played the best chess, and that's probably good enough.

Posted by: greg koster at October 13, 2006 12:28

Congratulations to Kramnik for the great victory. All discussion about the championship are over.

Thank to Mig for providing the only forum that didn't break during these exciting and intense games.

D.

Posted by: Dimi at October 13, 2006 12:28

Kramnik’s been number 1 before, at least in 1996 or so. He was quoted as saying something like ‘I was pleased for about fifteen minutes, then I went back to watching the news and forgot about it. Of course when you watch the news in Russia no-one can be happy.’

I don’t think he’s ever been that fussed about ratings; I’m not sure the top players are. Except Topalov, of course, who will now have to start calling himself the world number one.

I’m rather looking forward to his press conference. As a friend is wont to say to me after refuting my moves in analysis, ‘Not so full of yourself now, are you?’.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 12:28

Agree with RB. Compare:
=> Leko drew with Kramnik over the board
=> Topalov lost to Kramnik over the board

Posted by: zero@ego.com at October 13, 2006 12:30

I think we, as the chess public, need to accept a few things.

First, FIDE is going to hold two rounds of Candidates Matches from 16 players to determine who gets into the Challenger's Tournament - 4 players from the candidates and 4 seeded players. Right now, Topalov is out and he was one of the seeds, so a replacement has to be found, IF FIDE holds to the rules of the WCC 2006.

I think Leko deserves the pass to the tournament based on San Luis, so a replacement for Leko will need to be found...and then perhaps reshuffle the matches based on ratings, if needed.

Second, the victor of this challenger's tournament get a match with the current World Champion (Kramnik) for the Title. Most likely, it will be a 12-game match with similar tie-breaks.

In retrospect, I found the length of the match nearly perfect. 12 games and three weeks is plenty to decide who is best, and if it cannot be decided, then on to tiebreaks. The 4 rapid games were highly entertaining to me.

Ranting about 24-game matches, draw odds, etc., etc., are immaterial these days, and well, this is NOT your daddy's Chess title, so forget it.

Mig, any news about Topalov and his participation in Mexico yet?

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 12:30

Well done Vlad!

What do you think, will he accept match against Radjabov? What if he does and Radjabov wins? Will he replace Kramnik in Mexico? Could be a lot of confusion

Posted by: Goran at October 13, 2006 12:31

Once again great venue Mig

Perhaps you could put some ads and affiliate stuff to take adavanteg of traffic? One thing these 2 stuck to the same lines relentlessly in the tie break despite rapid format. I think Kramniks win is a good result for chess - will there be a Kramnik Radjabov match now?

Comments about Topalov being the better chess player dont make sense. This was a match - totally totally different from tournament. Good nerves and ability to take pressure is a very big part of being the best chess player in the world. The title does not go to the best analyst or the best opening innovator or the best entertainer. Kramnik beat the highest rated player in the world of chess despite that player having 1 extra white and getting a free point - who else could have done that in chess. I think nobody else.

Congratulations to World Chess Champion Vladamir Kramnik - a truly professional guy

Posted by: Andy at October 13, 2006 12:32

Viva Kramnik!

To end the scism, we now have a worthy World Champion! Chess fans all over the world salut you!

Posted by: Ronald at October 13, 2006 12:32

Any info on the rating changes for Potty and Kramster after the match?

Posted by: Todd at October 13, 2006 12:33

I think a fair assessment is that Topalov had better novelties prepared and generated winning chances out of the opening more often than Kramnik did. Even Kramnik concedes this is true. But Kramnik played the better chess at the board. Not perfect by any means, but better than Topalov's.

I think the difference is that while Kramnik may have played his share of inaccurate or imprecise moves, Topalov played far too many outright blunders. You just can't blunder so often at this level and expect to be world champion.

Topalov could very easily have been up 1.5-0.5, instead of down 0-2 at the end of the first two games. But I wouldn't assume he wins if that happens. Kramnik has shown repeatedly that he can win in must-win situations.

At this point, I have no hesitation saying that both the better PLAYER and the better PERSON won.

Posted by: Marc Shepherd at October 13, 2006 12:33

Incidentally, it's worth pointing out that Kramnik played by far the better OFF-the-board chess. His refusal to play Game 5 turned out to be the best move of the match: he got the changes reversed (probably the only way he could have done so), allowed the moral opprobrium to soak into Topalov, leaving him as the moral victor no matter what happened -- and, in a stroke of genius, ensured that no matter what happened, Topalov could never really win the match (unless he won by +2). Finally, in putting out the press release about sueing FIDE in the event of a Topalov "win", at such a critical time in the match, he placed huge pressure on Topalov to win big -- and Topalov folded.

The Topalov camp's crude attempts to manipulate the media and upset Kramnik were made to look totally amateurish by Kramnik's much more sophisticated approach. Dare I say that the trajectory of this off-the-board match resembles a chess game in and of itself? Topalov attacks like a loon, overpresses, blunders; Kramnik soaks up the pressure, defends in a sophisticated manner, strikes back -- and wins!

Posted by: Theorist at October 13, 2006 12:34

Well done Mig on the visits:)
What are the actual numbers?

Posted by: elitsa at October 13, 2006 12:37

"I wouldn't go as far as saying Kramnik played the better chess in the match."
"I don't know if the better player won today"

Can we please stop claiming that its a defect of Kramniks that Topalov blundered? Playing under pressure is perhaps the main feature of such a match and not delivering means you are not better. Taking advantage of your opponents errors is the essence of chess so give Kramnik his due. All this stuff about how far from perfect the moves were misses the fact that this was the human world chess championship and humans make mistakes which is not a bad thing but how they learn. Who learns from the mistakes and takes advantage of the others mistakes is the better player. Topalov might create exciting chess but in match play with the guy who beat the guy before him, he failed. Kramnik is better, period. That he survived all the off the board tactics makes his superiority even more convincing.

Posted by: Mduchamp at October 13, 2006 12:37

Ok, I have been informed I got it all wrong. Kramnik replaces Topalov in Mexico 2007 and *that* is the Championship Tournament.

I was under the impreassion it was a challenger's tournament.

Apparently match play is going the way of the doo doo bird. Hopefully after this match, FIDE will reconsider...

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 12:37

Poor Radjabov....

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 12:44

My Chessmetrics ratings have Smyslov #1 in 1958 and Tal #1 in 1961, so Botvinnik is the only other player I see having beaten the #1 twice in a match.

Posted by: Jeff Sonas at October 13, 2006 12:44

God do I hate John Sterling.

Posted by: Steve Wollkind at October 13, 2006 12:45

Rating changes?

Posted by: Todd at October 13, 2006 12:45

Mig just can't resist whipping it out and piddling on Kramnik every now and then. But if he can pull off his suggestion (posted at 12:11), he'll be the hero of the chess world.

Russianbear--
I'm not sure Topalov was actually calling Leko a "nobody". He may have been trying to say, "Look, the poor guy played Kramnik even in 2004 and what has it gotten him?"

Posted by: greg koster at October 13, 2006 12:47

"Mig, wake up, Wake Up! It's ok, the Yankees lost last night...it wasn't a nightmare. It was bad pitching."

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 12:48

Congratulations to World Chess Champion Vladimir Borisovich! It's nice to be able to forget about the ridiculous FIDE "champions" since 1993 and recognize that the line goes from ...Fischer, Karpov, and Kasparov to Kramnik (2000-2007+?).

Posted by: noyb at October 13, 2006 12:51

Well guys, so how many (FIDE) rating points did Topalov lost and how many did Kramnik gained ?

-Amit

Posted by: Amit at October 13, 2006 12:54

Greg Koster sez "Kramnik may not be the best chessplayer, but over the past three WCC matches he's played the best chess, and that's probably good enough."

Well said. True, I agree.

Posted by: d at October 13, 2006 13:00

The result from the tie-break removes any doubt in my mind as to who the better player is. Clearly it is Kramnik. This match went through a lot of back & forth, but the tie-break result solidifies in my mind Kramnik's superiority at this point in time.

D.

Posted by: Dimi at October 13, 2006 13:03

Greg, read the game 12 press conference with Top. The quote is from there...

Posted by: Albrecht von der Lieth at October 13, 2006 13:05

"Cooler" chess heads probably go on playing while keeping the lawsuit option open. People who don't throw tantrums don't show up at Appellation Committee's press conference pouting about lack of evidence and threaten lawsuits.

One of the most significant qualities of a good chess calculator is ability to avoid errors. Considering that in this match most errors came no earlier than late midgame it's hard to say that opening preparation made much of a difference.

No. This was a win of skill. And skill means being able to avoid serious errors. Especially with the amount of time limited Kramnik did a much better job in that than Topalov.

I find it hard to say that Kramnik is not the better chess player than Topalov. Perhaps less imaginative and certainly less offensive and risk-prone than Topalov. But when it comes to avoiding errors and spotting those of his opponent he once again proves himself to be one of the best. That is known as chess understanding.

Posted by: Yuriy Kleyner at October 13, 2006 13:07

Congrats to Kramnik. Deserved winner and moral winner.

What for Topalov now? Spirits crushed, reputation ruined, one million dollars minimum in Azeri oil money lost. Got to be difficult, not that he didn't bring it on himself.

Yet despite everything hopefully he will recover and will still get invitations to top tournaments. He is coming up with very original opening ideas, and what is remarkable is that it's happening early in the opening.

Hopefully he will eventually come to his senses once it's all over and the pressure wears off. Open apology to Kramnik and to the chess public and restraining Danailov on his future conduct would go a long way repairing the damage.

Then couple of tactical brilliances and eventually people will forget and forgive. Worse things have happened. Not the end of the world.

Posted by: AZ79 at October 13, 2006 13:11

I'd lay long odds against Topalov ever offering any kind of apology. Nothing he's ever done has suggested to me that he has the class, and firing these Svengali types is awfully difficult, especially as Danailov's the type to make trouble for him if he does.

I actually agree with those who say that Topalov has in some sense played the better chess in this match. Blunders are never just blunders - I'm sure nerves or whatever came into it - but equally there is a random element to them, and it IS unfortunate to have so many and such costly ones just now. Kramnik is not yet back to his best form - maybe he never will be - and has looked anything but invincible here. But of course it doesn't matter: Anand's sad comment after 1995 comes to mind; of course it doesn't matter what the winner does because he's always right.

I dipped into Gazza's Fighting Chess last night: here's a trivia question; who finished eighth in the World Junior Gazza won, ahead of several present-day grandmasters?

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 13:18

"Anand's sad comment after 1995 comes to mind; of course it doesn't matter what the winner does because he's always right."

what did he say?

Posted by: Albrecht von der Lieth at October 13, 2006 13:24

That is what he said. 'Of course it doesn't what the winner does because he's always right'.

(referring to some - comparatively extremely mild - antics by Gazza. But I thought it apposite here; it doesn't matter who's played better, because the result's in the scorebook.)

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 13:27

"Can we please stop claiming that its a defect of Kramniks that Topalov blundered? Playing under pressure is perhaps the main feature of such a match and not delivering means you are not better."

Hear hear. One of the main reasons I beat players 200 points below me, and lose to players 200 above me, is blundering in close but tense positions.

Posted by: Dan at October 13, 2006 13:28

Kramnik retained his title of World Chess Champion which he has held since 2000.

He now has the moral backing of all the chess world, with a few exceptions, and can refuse to defend his title except in a match.

The Mexico tournament (suggestion partly stolen from Mig) can serve as the old interzonals did - and choose the top players for thee Candidates Matches in 2008, and then we can have a WC match in 2009.

Posted by: inky at October 13, 2006 13:30

Grats to Kramnik, new chess WC.

Topa's strategy in this match was dead wrong -- he underestimated his adversary

Posted by: thenewone at October 13, 2006 13:30

Thanks for everything, Mig! Will consider donating or subscribing to your newsletter as a sign of gratitude.

I LOVE matches and didn't even mind having it short and having a tiebreak now afterwards.

For the future, here is what I hope:

1) Kramnik agrees to play Mexico and promises to give up title if he doesn't win.

2) Kramnik is given the right to a rematch (no draw odds) againt the winner of Mexico.

3) FIDE promises to stick to matches and starts a new circle to produce a candidate for a new match in say 2009.

Posted by: Jens Petersson at October 13, 2006 13:32

Reminds me very much of Karpov-Korchnoi 1978. Like Korchnoi, Topalov played the best chess, but he also played the worst chess, and the gross blunders outweighed the good stuff.

Posted by: Chris B at October 13, 2006 13:32

"Can we please stop claiming that its a defect of Kramniks that Topalov blundered?"

No one is saying it's a defect of Kramnik's that Topalov blundered. It's simply a reality that Kramnik's three wins came from horrendous blunders. Any reasonable analysis of the games shows that this is the case.

We don't know what would have happened otherwise --- Kramnik has a history of playing up to the level necessary to win. But in the games actually played, Topalov blundered, and badly. That's no defect of Kramnik. It's a defect of Topalov, actually.

Posted by: Marc Shepherd at October 13, 2006 13:35

Nisipeanu played a very imaginative long term piece sacrifice against Georgiev today and won with a brutal king attack. Reminds you of this brilliancy Kramnik played against Kasparov 10 years ago. http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1070865 , which has to be one of the worst defeats Garry has ever suffered with white.

(Another Slav so it fits in with the topic of the match)

Kramnik of course has the talent to play any style. But if he gets the best results with "stock exchange chess" who can blame him.

Catenaccio is well and alive in football, New Jersey won a few Stanley Cups preventing the opposition from playing.

Chess is so much richer this way. Style shouldn't come into it whether a player deserved to win or not. He just won his third World Championship match (ok one was drawn, but anyway), so obviously it's working fine.

Posted by: AZ79 at October 13, 2006 13:43

I did a little research on how #1 rated players did in World championship matches.
First, I thought like Mig that Other than Kramnik, only Botvinnik has beaten #1 rated player in the world more than once (they both done

it twice). But I was wrong! There was one more! Think before you read on :)

Let me say that I used chessmtetric's ratings(chessmetrics.com). I don't think chessmetrics are flawless - they are quite flawed when

comparing between eras, I believe, but within each particular monthly rating list I think chessmetrics has enough consistency/accuracy:

In the classical tradition there have been 14 champions and 39 World championship matches.

Out of those 39 matches, in 6 matches #1 rated player did not even play in the title match.

Steinitz - Gunsberg 1890 (Lasker was #1)
Steinitz - Chigorin 1892 (Lasker was #1)
Lasker - Marshall 1907 (Marуczy was #1, though Lasker got punished for inactivity, which doesn't exactly seem fair, Lasker won +8=7-0

and cemented chessmetrics #1 spot once again)
Lasker - Tarrasch 1908 (Rubinstein was #1)
Spassky - Petrosian 1969 (Fischer was #1)
Kramnik - Leko 2004 (Kasparov was #1)

But most of the time #1 rated player did play in the title match. Out of those 33 matches, #1 rated player failed to win just 13 times.

Out of those 12 matches, The top rated players had drawn 4

Lasker-Schlechter 1910 (Lasker was #1)
Botvinnik-Bronstein 1951 (Bronstein rated #1)
Botvinnik-Smyslov 1954 (Smyslov rated #1)
Kasparov-Karpov 1987(Kasparov rated #1 prior to the match)

and once the match was not finished:

Karpov-Kasparov 1984 (Kasparov rated #1 prior to the match)

That leaves us with just 8 matches where top rated player in the world was beaten in the world championship match.

Alekhine-Capablanca 1927
Euwe-Alekhine 1935
Alekhine-Euwe 1937 (Euwe took over the first spot after his match victory against Alekhine,
but then lost it twice and regained it twice before the rematch with Alekhine -
once to Botvinnik (late 1936) and another to Capablanca (mid 1937). It is a testament to how great Botvinnik has been,
he became #1 as early as 1936 and yet beat Tal in 1961 at the edge of 50.)
Botvinnik-Smyslov 1958
Botvinnik-Tal 1961
Petrossian-Spassky 1966
Kramnik-Kasparov 2000
Kramnik-Topalov 2006

So, Alekhine also beat two top rated players in the world (Capablanca, Euwe) in World Championship matches. By beating Topalov Kramnik joines Botvinnik and Alekhine as the only players to beat top rated player in the world 2 times. It is worth noting that Botvinnik, in addition to beating 2 World number 1's, also drew 2 more WC matches against top rated players. And Alekhine, in addition to beating a top rated player twice, also lost one of the world championships where he himself was the number one

player.

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 13:48

I did a little research on how #1 rated players did in World championship matches.
First, I thought like Mig that Other than Kramnik, only Botvinnik has beaten #1 rated player in the world more than once (they both done it twice). But I was wrong! There was one more! Think before you read on :)

Let me say that I used chessmtetric's ratings(chessmetrics.com). I don't think chessmetrics are flawless - they are quite flawed when comparing between eras, I believe, but within each particular monthly rating list I think chessmetrics has enough consistency/accuracy:

In the classical tradition there have been 14 champions and 39 World championship matches.

Out of those 39 matches, in 6 matches #1 rated player did not even play in the title match.

Steinitz - Gunsberg 1890 (Lasker was #1)
Steinitz - Chigorin 1892 (Lasker was #1)
Lasker - Marshall 1907 (Marуczy was #1, though Lasker got punished for inactivity, which doesn't exactly seem fair, Lasker won +8=7-0 and cemented chessmetrics #1 spot once again)
Lasker - Tarrasch 1908 (Rubinstein was #1)
Spassky - Petrosian 1969 (Fischer was #1)
Kramnik - Leko 2004 (Kasparov was #1)

But most of the time #1 rated player did play in the title match. Out of those 33 matches, #1 rated player failed to win just 13 times.

Out of those 13 matches, The top rated players had drawn 4

Lasker-Schlechter 1910 (Lasker was #1)
Botvinnik-Bronstein 1951 (Bronstein rated #1)
Botvinnik-Smyslov 1954 (Smyslov rated #1)
Kasparov-Karpov 1987(Kasparov rated #1 prior to the match)

and once the match was not finished:

Karpov-Kasparov 1984 (Kasparov rated #1 prior to the match)

That leaves us with just 8 matches where top rated player in the world was beaten in the world championship match.

Alekhine-Capablanca 1927
Euwe-Alekhine 1935
Alekhine-Euwe 1937 (Euwe took over the first spot after his match victory against Alekhine,
but then lost it twice and regained it twice before the rematch with Alekhine -
once to Botvinnik (late 1936) and another to Capablanca (mid 1937). It is a testament to how great Botvinnik has been,
he became #1 as early as 1936 and yet beat Tal in 1961 at the edge of 50.)
Botvinnik-Smyslov 1958
Botvinnik-Tal 1961
Petrossian-Spassky 1966
Kramnik-Kasparov 2000
Kramnik-Topalov 2006

So, Alekhine also beat two top rated players in the world (Capablanca, Euwe) in World Championship matches. By beating Topalov Kramnik joines Botvinnik and Alekhine as the only players to beat top rated player in the world 2 times. It is worth noting that Botvinnik, in addition to beating 2 World number 1's, also drew 2 more WC matches against top rated players. And Alekhine, in addition to beating a top rated player twice, also lost one of the world championships where he himself was the number one player.

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 13:50

You could argue that Karpov played the better chess in 1987 and blunders cost him the match. But the point is academic, because blunders are part of the game.

Posted by: AZ79 at October 13, 2006 13:51

Russianbear--

Thanks for your good work.

Posted by: greg koster at October 13, 2006 13:52

Interesting, thanks. I thought of Alekhine but couldn't imagine Euwe took the #1 spot. But I guess if you play that many games against the #1 and finish ahead of him your chances are pretty good. Still, I don't feel the 1937 match the way I do the other four. Euwe played his best chess and still clearly overmatched by an in-form Alekhine. The math is there but nobody had Euwe as a favorite then, and with good reason.

Posted by: Mig at October 13, 2006 13:54

I don't think Kramnik would agree, Mig. In his excellent article on his predecessors, he seem to give Euwe more credit than people usualy do and give Alekhine less than his usual:

http://www.e3e5.com/eng/petersburg/creativity/article.html?12

As for me I think Euwe just played extremely well for a couple of years (almost like Fischer and Tal had their 1-2 year peaks), and then got content with the accomplishemnt of wining the title and was never the same (kinda like Spassky).

Posted by: Russianbear at October 13, 2006 14:06

Looking at the match overall, I think Kramnik is to be congratulated on his win. Topalov's opening preparation was far better ( was there in fact any evidence at all of Kramnik's preparation ? ) and he was continually confronted with having to solve problems over the board which Topalov had studied deeply at home. That meant he was always under time and psychological pressure.

I came away with the impression that Kramnik's understanding of chess is simply deeper - only once did Topalov outplay him in a queenless ending and that was very difficult to defend anyway. Much of the rest of the time Topalov resembled a high-class coffeehouse slugger relying on bluff to get a win, but running up against someone who was cool enough to see through that and find the holes.

I don't want to be too critical of Topalov though - it was the contrast of styles and his determination and aggression which was the cause of the tension and excitement. All credit to him for that.

The question now is what will Kramnik do with the title ? I pretty sure he won't milk it for as much money as he can the way Topalov's manager was planning to...

David

Posted by: David at October 13, 2006 14:08

"We are planning to get drunk with my friends today"
Vladimir Kramnik

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6049276.stm

LOL :-D

Posted by: Severin at October 13, 2006 14:09

I think some people did have Euwe as favourite for the second match against Alekhine (maybe even most). Euwe was I think the form player going in to the match. Its one of my favourite matches actually, really dynamic chess.

Posted by: Mark Crowther at October 13, 2006 14:15

A few more idle thoughts.....

Every game began with 1.d4. (Has there ever been a WC where that was the case?)

Now, everyone expected Kramnik to use 1.d4. But from Topalov's history, as far as I can tell, this was atypical. Topalov had so much respect for Kramnik's 1.e4 defense that he did not dare play it.

Topalov's 1.d4 repertory and his responses to it were arguably one-dimensional. Although he got a lot of novelties out of the opening, fundamentally he was playing it on Kramnik's terms, and not the other way around.

Posted by: Marc Shepherd at October 13, 2006 14:26

Harry Golombek's introduction to the 1937 Alekhine - Euwe match book.

"The result was a surprise to the chess world and many reasons have been put forward to explain Alekhine's triumph. It has been said that at the beginning of the match Euwe underestimated his opponent and that by the time he realized Alekhine's true strength the latter had established an invincible lead."

I was pretty sure people thought Euwe the favourite in 1937.

Posted by: Mark Crowther at October 13, 2006 14:27

...

I think the difference is that while Kramnik may have played his share of inaccurate or imprecise moves, Topalov played far too many outright blunders. You just can't blunder so often at this level and expect to be world champion.

Topalov could very easily have been up 1.5-0.5, instead of down 0-2 at the end of the first two games. But I wouldn't assume he wins if that happens. Kramnik has shown repeatedly that he can win in must-win situations.

...

-- Posted by: Marc Shepherd at October 13, 2006 12:33

You hit the nail right on the head.

Posted by: gmnotyet at October 13, 2006 14:30

Taking the c5 pawn in the last game was not only a blunder, it was like his mind has been other places. Strange.

Posted by: freitag at October 13, 2006 14:34

"Now, everyone expected Kramnik to use 1.d4. But from Topalov's history, as far as I can tell, this was atypical. Topalov had so much respect for Kramnik's 1.e4 defense that he did not dare play it."

I thought Kramnik was more likely than Topalov to use 1.e4.

Posted by: acirce at October 13, 2006 14:35

I hate to interrupt this Kramnik admiration society, but its got to be said.

Kramnik deserved to win the match, but he doesn't deserve to be World Champion. Someday chess will move into the 21st Century and have a World Championship in which all players are treated equally. I seem to be the only one that feels that way at the moment, so that day is a long way off, but it will happen.


Posted by: Spud at October 13, 2006 14:40

Topalov didn't criticize Leko, he sympathized with him. Of course Leko is not a nobody, everybody knows he one of the world's top players. But even during this match, nobody seemed to mention the Kramnik-Leko match which was a tie.

There was even some hope after it that Leko would get another match soon because Kramnik had not actually defeated him. But that didn't happen.

Leko is hardly talked about and is being ignored in various ways, so he's being treated as a nobody. He may also be having a hard time coming back and working his way thru the FIDE cycle again. That is certainly what Topalov meant.

Kramnik is now the FIDE champion, succeeding Topalov, and must follow FIDE's rules. Those rules say that he can hold the title until the Mexico WC tournament.

Someone said that boycotting San Luis didn't pay off for Kramnik. Oh yeah?

1. He got to play a 1 on 1 match for the FIDE title rather than a tournament of many players, so his odds were much better just by raw numbers.

2. He's believed to be better at matches than tournaments.

3. There's that $500,000 he just won for the "unification" which really amounted to submitting himself to FIDE's regime. If he had played in San Luis he would have given up the ability to claim that extra payment.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 14:42

"I am planning to get drunk with my only friend"
Veselin Topalov

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 14:43

Spud you are not the only one who feels that way. I do too.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 14:44

Folks,

Don't forget to drop a mail to FIDE and sound off about the frankly infuriating way their servers failed during a decisive part of a historic match.

The continuing absence of a congratulation to the World Champion might also be worth a comment...

admin@fide.com


Cheers, and a pleasant weekend to all!

Posted by: Sirocco at October 13, 2006 14:53

If San Luis was a "good" championship, the results must be a true indication of participants' relative strength.

If so, Kramnik proved himself to be better (IMO, considerably better) than a player who finished heads and shoulders above the rest of participants in that tournament.

Given that, I don't think whether Kram played San Luis or not really matters.

Posted by: Yuriy Kleyner at October 13, 2006 14:56

Certainly it would be nicer to have some photos and words from the official site. Instead we only have this??

http://www.worldchess2006.com/main.asp?id=1143

Posted by: Louis at October 13, 2006 14:57

Anand some time back rather candidly said he would take whatever world championship offers he thought was in his own best interests. It wasn't any of the top players fault that they were forced to get on with their careers in the best way they could. Kramnik defended his title against Leko. Topalov, Morozevich and Adams also played in that Dortmund qualifier and then had another shot in San Luis. Kasparov had an invitation and turned it down. I really rather doubt anyone else would have beaten Topalov in this match and the fact they could play at all under all this tension, especially in the rapid playoff games which were under the circumstances really rather splendid games is credit to the both of them. Kramnik is the deserved champion. Lets hope we can get a proper cycle that works year in year out in place as fast as possible and that Kramnik defends his title in Mexico City. I'm personally really happy I can once again ask the question who is the world chess champion in two words not fifty or more.

Posted by: Mark Crowther at October 13, 2006 15:02

Anand some time back rather candidly said he would take whatever world championship offers he thought was in his own best interests. It wasn't any of the top players fault that they were forced to get on with their careers in the best way they could. Kramnik defended his title against Leko. Topalov, Morozevich and Adams also played in that Dortmund qualifier and then had another shot in San Luis. Kasparov had an invitation and turned it down. I really rather doubt anyone else would have beaten Topalov in this match and the fact they could play at all under all this tension, especially in the rapid playoff games which were under the circumstances really rather splendid games is credit to the both of them. Kramnik is the deserved champion. Lets hope we can get a proper cycle that works year in year out in place as fast as possible and that Kramnik defends his title in Mexico City. I'm personally really happy I can once again ask the question who is the world chess champion in two words not fifty or more.

Posted by: Mark Crowther at October 13, 2006 15:03

Along with press conference transcripts and pics
I'd like to see a recent pic of Danailov. Wonder what kind of a smirk he has now.

Ahhhh, schadenfreude.

Posted by: Doom & Gloom Dave at October 13, 2006 15:03

"But in the games actually played, Topalov blundered, and badly. That's no defect of Kramnik. It's a defect of Topalov, actually."

Precisely my point yet these blunders are being used to claim that Kramnik's chess was not as strong--he only won because Topalov blundered. I thought finding the best move made you better, playing bad moves makes you worse. All the talk about how Topalov could have, should have been up 2-0 instead of down are just wishful thinking. If a frog had wings it wouldn't bump its ass so much....

Posted by: mduchamp at October 13, 2006 15:04

Mig, On the Morelia page you typed every variant of the phrase World Champion. World Champion, world champion, or World champion. Was this some notation or just randomness?

Posted by: DP at October 13, 2006 15:05

I've seen those numbers and made similar analysis myself, but I think chessmetrics is, at times, skewed. Nobody in 1890 regarded Lasker as #1 or anywhere near it.

Maybe we should name Topalov "Vice World Champion". Cause when I think if his behavior in this match, I think of vice.

Posted by: Graeme at October 13, 2006 15:20

I've seen those numbers and made similar analysis myself, but I think chessmetrics is, at times, skewed. Nobody in 1890 regarded Lasker as #1 or anywhere near it.

Maybe we should name Topalov "Vice World Champion". Cause when I think of his behavior in this match, I think of vice.

Posted by: Graeme at October 13, 2006 15:20

Oh Lordy, some much needed comic relief.

I found this on the comments section of "64". Someone had some fun with photoshop.

http://rsport.netorn.ru/potemkin/enot/foto052.htm

Posted by: Myron Samsin at October 13, 2006 15:25

1) I congratulate Vladimir Kramnik on winning an extremely tense match. It was a truly heroic feat, and I am not saying that lightly.
2) I hope the next World Championship will again be a *match*, not a tournament; I am sure the World Champion agrees.
3) And, last but not least: I hope we will find it in our hearts to readmit Veselin Topalov to the circle of players we admire. There are wounds now, they will heal - perhaps even their scars may disappear someday.

Posted by: Charles Milton Ling at October 13, 2006 15:26

Friday the 13th of October 2006 will remain a great day in chess history! A champion's triumph against all odds, a successful unification of the World Chess Champion titles.

Chess is not a big sport like the truly big sports, football, soccer, formula one, etc.etc. - Ok, we may not be big but we are alive and we have more relations to the worlds of art and science than all these primitive "muscle and sweat" sports. We are looking into a bright future - a bit smaller than others, but very nice!

Posted by: Permanent Brain at October 13, 2006 15:32

Given that, I don't think whether Kram played San Luis or not really matters.

--Posted by: Yuriy Kleyner at October 13, 2006 14:56

The only classical games Kramnik won were due directly to Topalov's ??-blunders.

It is -highly- unlikely that Kramnik would have won San Luis or any other tournament by just winning games when his opponents ??s.

Now -matches-, that is a different story. There you can just sit back and do nothing, waiting for your opponent to self-destruct and give you free points.

But that win-only-when-my-opponent-??s does not work in tournaments.

If you think Kramnik is so strong that San Luis would have been a cakewalk, then surely Kramnik will not duck Mexico City, right?

And do you really think Kramnik would have scored +8 or +9 at San Luis when the only classical games he won here were the results of ??-moves?

Posted by: gmnotyet at October 13, 2006 15:34

I, too, understood Euwe to be the favourite, if anything, going into the 1937 match. His results between the two matches were better than Alekhine's.
I think there may be a good case to consider Euwe as the No. 1 just before going into the match as the 1936 performers Botvinnik and Capablanca had declined in 1937 (Botvinnik with the Levenfish match, and Capa with Semmering-Baden). I think we tend to discount Euwe because he got slaughtered in the 1937 match, and had that terrible result in the 1948 World Championship Match Tournament; but just BEFORE the 1937 match I think he was favourite.
Very good analysis Russianbear!

To go slightly off-topic (hope you don't mind in this instance, Mig), if Jeff Sonas is reading this, may I apologise to you for not yet having got back to you as I promised under 'Kramnik-Topalov g4'. In the first place my analysis took a lot longer than I intended (I have a lot of good stuff for you!), second, there's been the WC distraction(!), and third my elderly mother fell and broke her hip, necessitating a major hip replacement operation [she has come thru ok]. I definitely hope to post to you in 2-3 days (under 'Kramnik-Topalov g4').
In my view (which I will try to justify):
Steinitz or Tarrasch is No. 1 in 1890.
Tarrasch is No. 1 in 1892.
Lasker is No.1 in 1907.
Lasker is No.1 in 1908.
Botvinnik is No.1 going into the 1951 Match.

Posted by: Chris B at October 13, 2006 15:38

Russianbear thanks for the link

http://www.e3e5.com/eng/petersburg/creativity/

it's a great website and a very interesting article by someone well qualified to write it.

It's a history of match-play champions, and that is indeed a gripping story. The idea of "tournament" world champions is harder to understand and maybe not even a good idea. There would also be more faces to write about, making such an article too long.

But tournament-play is the system we have now, and there are too many closely matched players at the top to abandon that system now. This is a time when FIDE, not the champion himself, has to set the rules.

Minor niggle: he only mentions "Morfi" once in passing while starting history from Steinitz. Here in the USA we tend to start with Morphy.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 15:41

Is Kramnik the best?
I doubt, but he is in my all-time Top 50 list!

Posted by: freitag at October 13, 2006 15:41

"Precisely my point yet these blunders are being used to claim that Kramnik's chess was not as strong--he only won because Topalov blundered. I thought finding the best move made you better, playing bad moves makes you worse. All the talk about how Topalov could have, should have been up 2-0 instead of down are just wishful thinking. If a frog had wings it wouldn't bump its ass so much...."

I think you misunderstand what people are saying. It's simply a fact that his wins were achieved primarily through through his opponent's rather severe blunders. It's not a matter of "would have, could have, should have." It's just a matter of being honest about how Kramnik's wins came about.

Posted by: Marc Shepherd at October 13, 2006 15:41

Whether you want matches to decide the world title or not it would be sheer folly to change the system once its in place and a sponsor has been found. The Candidates series has to go ahead and the final tournament in Mexico City. Anything else would be unfair on the other players involved and their chance at a title. The following cycle is up for grabs though. FIDE have put themselves in a bind by the exclusion of Topalov (or Kramnik if he'd lost) however.

Posted by: Mark Crowther at October 13, 2006 15:44

Euwe said that in 1935, when he won, he was weaker than Alekhine, but that in 1937 he was stronger. He also attributed his loss in 1937 to overconfidence. I think he was definitely the favourite in people's eyes.

That article by Kramnik talking about the world champions is a very interesting read. He, incidentally, says in there that Lasker was miles ahead of the rest in the early 1890s.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 15:44

Let this be the first, only, and LAST Match World Chess Championship match that involved short time controls (Rapid, Blitz, Armageddon) in tie-breaking.
Rapid games should be restricted to Rapid title matches, Blitz games to Blitz titles, etc.

Another bad aspect was the exclusion of the loser from the next world championship cycle. Imagine if Spassky had been barred from challenging Petrosian in 1969 because Petrosian had defeated Spassky in the 1966 title match!

The Fix: Change the rules to allow Topalov a spot in Mexico 2007. But as a necessary part of that, RE-CAST the Mexico 2007 tournament to have the purpose of determining who next gets to challenge Kramnik for the Match WCC title.

If Topalov is allowed to play in Mexico 2007 without the re-casting of purpose, then it would be a bias & unfair gift to FIDE's Topalov that FIDE would never have given to Kramnik.

The list remains...


Steinitz , Lasker , Capablanca , Alekhine
, Euwe , Botvinnik , Smyslov , Tal
, Petrosian , Spassky , Fischer , Karpov
, Kasparov , Kramnik.


Gene Milener
http://CastleLong.com/

Posted by: Gene_M at October 13, 2006 15:50

Kramnik didn't win game 2 because Topalov blundered, exactly. The course of the game was rather upset by a horrible mutual blunder, true, but in the end Kramnik won by prevailing in a very unclear ending in which both sides were playing for a win at one time.

An amazing comeback by Kramnik to my mind after what happened, and losing like a child in games eight and nine. But what little things these matches turn on - suppose Topalov hadn't played 24....f6?? in game ten? I suspect this was like Nijinsky's St Leger, an awful lot closer even that it looked.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 15:51

Incidentally, the idea of someone above to make Mexico a tournament for the world championship, but with the champion guaranteed a rematch if he doesn't win, strikes me as a brilliant one. Keeps the Mexico sponsors happy, and us happy. What could be better?

I imagine the Mexico sponsors need a bit of cheering up just now. They'd have surely preferred Topalov, especially as I imagine he's very popular in Mexico, being a kind of honorary Spaniard.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 15:54

Mig wrote:

"Every day since the match began, my traffic was roughly three time my daily average and double the last few event daily averages. San Luis was over 50% higher, quite a spike. But nothing close to the relative leap from Elista.
...
my traffic numbers [were] similar to that of TWIC and much better than that of ChessCafe. And they PAY people ... Shows the power of community ..."

Yes it does show the power of community. It also shows the power of a 1-on-1 match over a tournament.

ChessCafe.com was not even on the radar during this huge event. ChessCafe.com is a major chess website, but its lack of a blog (with a viewpoint to discuss) sometimes makes that website feel stale.


Kramnik was the biggest winner in this event.
But Mig and Susan Polgar, with their blogs, also came out as big winners.

Posted by: Gene_M at October 13, 2006 16:04

>And do you really think Kramnik would have scored +8 or +9 at San Luis when the only classical games he won here were the results of ??-moves?
Posted by: gmnotyet at October 13, 2006 15:34
>

Your criticisms are, frankly, irrational. Kramnik just took on one of the big powerhouses of our time, compared by some to Kasparov in his prime, regarded by many as unstoppable. Played him in FIDE's home court. Not only beat him, but beat him in a handicap match, with one fewer white, and an unprecedented three straight blacks. Turned around and beat him again in a Rapids playoff, and in your mind, he's a great big chicken because he *might* want to defend his title the same way all 13 of his predecessors did.

No offense man, but that's more than a bit nutty. Go have a drink. Kramnik is. It'd be better than those sour grapes you're drinking now.

Posted by: Charles at October 13, 2006 16:05

The traffic doesn't show the power of a match over a tournament.It shows the power of Topalov to draw crowds. Imagine a Kramnik - Leko match. Even the people who post here regularly would leave.

Posted by: dirtbag at October 13, 2006 16:08

I understand Kramnik's manager stated before the match that his client would not play in Mexico City. I am afraid the World Chess Championship mess is not finished yet!

Posted by: ed at October 13, 2006 16:13

Please compare Elista vs. Brissago. That is a meaningful comparison.

Posted by: dirtbag at October 13, 2006 16:14

"...But Mig and Susan Polgar, with their blogs, also came out as big winners..."

Oh really? Susan Polgar posted an article on her blog which stated something like "how do we know Kramnik wasn't really cheating in the bathroom?".

I don't think that reflects too well on her.

Posted by: chess fan at October 13, 2006 16:24

Mig,

Perhaps a good way to capitalize off all this traffic is to have the DailyDirt do to chess what DailyKos.com did for politics. Creative a more interactive forum where users can submit chess news, opinions, and trivia from around the globe.

Theres ad revenue there, not to mention it would be the first chess site of its kind. If I had the time and money, I'd invest in something like it myself.

Just a thought

-Stephen

Posted by: Ellsworth Toohey at October 13, 2006 16:24

Only Kamsky has the capacity to beat Kramnik in a match.

Posted by: dirtbag at October 13, 2006 16:25

There's no reason Kramnik should be ashamed to avoid the Mexico City tournament. It doesn't resolve the championship issue, but would bring it back into turmoil since it's a poor way to select champions.

Kramnik should do what he's been saying since 2000: fight for a dignified system of qualifiers and a nice match. Go Vlad!

Posted by: David O. at October 13, 2006 16:26

"I understand Kramnik's manager stated before the match that his client would not play in Mexico City."

No, he didn't. He said they would start negotiations about the format, trying to find the best way to connect traditions to contemporary realities.

I would be surprised if Kramnik split away again.

Posted by: acirce at October 13, 2006 16:26

Kramnik a deserved winner. Topalov played too ambitious, to many blunders, and in the rapids he did kind of self-destruct. Kramnik's best game? Guess the last rapid, gradually increasing his advantage.

Topalov may take comfort in the fact that he still is the nr 1 ranked player in the world, with the ranking system being the best measurement of the world strongest player. Prestigious to have the title World Champion, but also prestigious to be ranked nr 1. Kramnik the World Champion and Topalov the world's strongest player (as Kasparov is not playing).

Posted by: Akselborg at October 13, 2006 16:37


Mainstrean coverage!

Front page of Boston.com (the web page of the Boston Globe, Boston, MA USA's largest newspaper):

http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2006/10/13/kramnik_crowned_world_chess_champion/

Posted by: Globular at October 13, 2006 16:40

I find the Kramnik article to be a little odd in places to be honest (though I would not claim to be anywhere near his strength).
He claims that Lasker 'absolutely smashed' Steinitz in 1894. The actual score was +10 -5 =4 (12-7). While a large difference, I would not describe it as an absolute smashing, and I am wondering if Kramnik is thinking more of their return match in 1896/7, which was indeed a smashing (+10 -2 =5 or 12.5-4.5). eg Fischer beat Spassky in 1972 12.5-7.5 on actual games, but I don't think this match was considered an 'absolute smashing'.
I don't understand Kramnik's saying that Tarrasch wasn't very good in early 1890's and got stronger later. Tarrasch won 4 big tournaments Breslau 1889, Manchester 1890, Dresden 1892, and Leipzig 1894. He rarely got results like this later.
Also, Kramnik says 'Lasker stood head and shoulders above the others ...in the beginning of 1890's...this...lasted two or three years, and then he was run down by those, who had evidently had learned from him.' How can Lasker's giant victories at St Petersburg 1895/6, Nuremburg 1896, London 1899, and Paris 1900 be being 'run down' by the others?
Seems strange talk to me.

Posted by: Chris B at October 13, 2006 16:44

The traffic doesn't show the power of a match over a tournament.It shows the power of Topalov to draw crowds. Posted by: dirtbag at October 13, 2006 16:08
>>

Yeah, but he only drew those crowds by sacrificing his character. He has no character left to be able to do it again.

Posted by: Graeme at October 13, 2006 16:55

Only Kamsky has the capacity to beat Kramnik in a match.
Posted by: dirtbag at October 13, 2006 16:25

AMEN

Posted by: inky at October 13, 2006 16:56

As I was saying before the match...
Kramnik has won Linares 3 times
Kramnik has won Dortmund 7 times
Kramnik has positive head to head records against Anand, Kasparov and Topalov (100% of the +2800 players)
Before the match, Kramnik had a clear plus against Topalov. After the match, the plus just got bigger.

Well done, Vlad. Now, you can go and watch football for a few years. Then you'll wake up a few months before the start of your future title defense, prepare a little, and disgust another chess monster with your huge natural talent.

Vlad is the guy who ended Kasparov's career.
Vlad is the guy who transformed Leko in "nobody", according to Topalov.
Vlad is the guy who placed Topalov's ego into a toilet, and flushed it (how cooool !!!!).

By the way, Kramnik defended his title in abnormal conditions. In a normal world, the WC keeps his title in case of equality. In Elista, Topalov even had a full bonus point. Two point difference with regular WC conditions...

Another remark, the rating opposition faced by Kramnik in his world championships is also totally unprecedented. Kasparov was 2849, Leko 2763 and Topalov 2813.

Before the match, when I was saying that Kramnik's head to head results against the best rated players ever made him one of the two strongest chess players ever, everybody did laugh at me. Well ... I think that now Kasparov, Karpov, Fischer and Kramnik can reasonnably be considered the four best players ever.

Kramnik's performances since he came back to chess in Turin this year : Turin, 2847. Dortmund, 2813. Elista, 2844. So please, to every idi... oh sorry I can't say that, to every nice person who called him drawnik (5 decisive games out of 11), cowardnik (offering a full point to his opponent to end the schism in the chess world), lyer about his illness, and so on... welcome to reality.

We are lucky. Kramnik's not only a huge champion, he's also a gentleman. Even in the worse moments in Elista, when most of you were yelling everywhere and insulting Topalov, he just stayed himself.

Vlad, congratulations. Great champion, great man, great gentleman. No doubt you now will take advantage of your title and of the situation to help the chess world to get rid of Makropoulos, Azmaiparashvili, Danailov, to offer a chance to Kirsan to do a better job introducing a brand new team with Kirsan as honorary president (the guy with the $$$) and Kok as manager (the guy with the brain)... now, you've got everything in your hands to bring the chess world out of his perpetual mess.

Posted by: ruslan at October 13, 2006 16:59

"..Only Kamsky has the capacity to beat Kramnik in a match..."

To qualify, Kamsky must first defeat Short in chessboxing.

www.wcbo.org/

Posted by: chess fan at October 13, 2006 16:59

"Only Kamsky has the capacity to beat Kramnik in a match"

Kamsky is out of time. As a lawyer he can only win by protest (the next toilet game).

Posted by: freitag at October 13, 2006 17:01

I am kind of surprised by some of the negativity towards Kram. I am no big fan of his either, and was bitterly disappointed by Topalov's performance until Game 5 when, like so many others, I changed allegiance.

Kramnik is simply a technician, the latest in a long line of 'boring' players, such as Reshevsky, Smyslov, Karpov et al. None of these guys have been big favs with the masses like a Tal, but gosh, Kramnik plays strong chess. One must at least respect it if not appreciate it.

Posted by: Dondo at October 13, 2006 17:04

Congrats to Kramnik, who one has to grant World Champion status. He beat the guy who cleaned up at the FIDE tourney.

Today once again reignited my dislike for rapid / blitz tiebreaks to determine the title. However, if it can't be decided in classical time controls, better in the rapids than in blitz games.

Posted by: bpk at October 13, 2006 17:07

Well today is truly one of bittersweet memories. On the one hand, Kramnik pulled off the victory to in a Hollywood manner to have his Hollywood ending. On the other, President Bush signed the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act on this very same day, sending the online poker world into the type of chaos that usually requires the acronym “FIDE” be associated with it to generate such a mess in so short a time. For me personally, it is overall a tragic day, with Kramnik’s victory providing a mere moment of comfort, but I am happy that bigger fans of chess are so thrilled with today’s history.

As to the whole rumbling that Kramnik didn’t win the match so much as Topalov lost it with his blunders, I would suggest that in many top level competitive endeavors between world class contestants, games are more often won by avoiding mistakes rather than brilliant plays, simply because as world-class players the contestants have too much experience to be susceptible to flashy, unforeseen, startling plays. Great examples are the current 2006 Denver Broncos, the 2000 Superbowl champions Baltimore Ravens, the 2003 SB champ Tampa Bay Bucs in the NFL, the Detroit Pistons recent reign in the NBA, and more. These teams played “ball-control” strategies of conservative, low variance on offence (preferring to safely punt / not give up the fast-break rather than risk giving any easy points to the opponent), coupled with a philosophy of defense that would look to capitalize on opponents’ aggression on offence and force them into mistakes. The very heart of poker is on the defensive side of the ball – making less mistakes is the goal, not more brilliant plays than your opponent, contrary to what people want to believe about poker and sports.

Kramnik fits right in line with this type of “Mike Shanahan” approach to the game, knowing that he can win more games by simply having less mistakes on offence than his over-anxious, “wilder” opponent. When facing a Topalov or a Kasparov, this counter-strategy is extremely smart, since you are only playing their game if you enter the free-for-all offensive style.

To now somehow say that Kramnik should not get ‘credit’ for his victories either though his strategy was exactly to “create turnovers” while avoiding his own turnovers at all cost is just being blind, period. It is the poorly informed spectator that only concentrates on the offensive side of the game when the defensive side and strategy can be equally (if not more, judging by recent results in other sports) important in determining the better competitor.

Commentators may say that Topalov had more novelties and played more dynamic chess, but with these innovations and dynamics is the burden of proof that these provide more ways to win than to lose. Maybe the ‘scoreboard’ (Fritz) said that Topalov was winning during some points in the first few games, but a highly tactical style is inherently prone to the ‘big turnover’ (blunders), so when it happens you cannot just discount it as an outlier result, but rather must incorporate its chances of happening into calculating whether or not Topalov is a better player. So what if Fritz says that Topalov should have won if he found an exact line of play – that is the difficulty of a high variance offense of walking the tight-rope without a single slip. Kramnik bet that Topalov would slip more often than he would navigate that rope. It is not the score at halftime that matters, but at the end of the game.

“Slow and Steady Wins the Race” is not only a legitimate strategy in chess, but is indeed a very clever one when facing a high-variance offense over many games that a match structure provides.

Now back to trying to get my money out of all the online poker sites listed on the London Stock Exchange and crying.

Posted by: Stern at October 13, 2006 17:12

Well done Stern!

Posted by: greg koster at October 13, 2006 17:21

Agree, Stern!

As much as we all appreciate dynamic play and occasional heroics, there is beauty and wisdom in careful defense. That's how most people act I guess - strive for greatness, but keep your feet on the ground.

Posted by: NikonMike at October 13, 2006 17:36

Stern,

Enjoyed reading your post, especially the analogies. Thanks.

Posted by: chesstraveler at October 13, 2006 17:51

According my database
Kamnik vs Kasparov +21=80-22
Kramnik vs Anand +13=85-18
Kramnik vs Topalov +21=37-9

for a total of Minus 6. against the first two

Posted by: Eo at October 13, 2006 17:58

rdh Kramnik should have no guarantee of a rematch if he doesn't win Mexico. What about Topalov, if he's excluded from the field? Leko, whom Kramnik did not defeat but wouldn't give a rematch to? Kasparov whom Kramnik would not give the expected rematch? Shirov who beat Kramnik?

Kramnik just won his first FIDE World Championship. That puts him equal to Kasimzhdanov, Ponomariov, etc. in that regard. I am not saying that anyone will forget his match win against Kasparov, and he can claim the "Classical" championship from that. But he's got to start putting together his FIDE string now.

Topalov and Kasparov (defeated champion's rematch), Leko (tied championship match) and Shirov (beat Kramnik, unjustly denied title shot) are all still around and each has some special claim to challenge Kramnik for his FIDE title, in my opinion. At any rate, he'll have good competition in Mexico next year.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 17:58

Another recent example - two actually - from the world of football (real football, ie soccer :P) are the two winners of recent large championships.

Greece won the European championships 2004 after beating world-class opposition (France, Portugal). Their quarter-final, semi-final AND final scores were 1-0 (in all three matches). No goals conceded = win the cup! And they did deserve it then, even though they played really boring, closely organised football.

The last WC football, same story. Italy conceded a total of two goals in the entire championships. One from an own goal, one from a penalty.

Defending is a more important part of many sports than most people care to realise.

Posted by: Marvol at October 13, 2006 18:01

Any words from the press conference? Misha Salinov, where are you?

Posted by: Photos at October 13, 2006 18:03

It's relatively well known that Kramnik claimed to have been inspired by the Czech hockey team for his defensive strategy against Kasparov. From a New In Chess interview immediately after the match:

"When did you decide on this generally defensive strategy?"

"I follow ice hockey a bit, and the Czech national team has been winning everything the last couple of years. The Olympics, championships, everything. But they never score more than two goals. Which is not normal for ice hockey. They always win 2-0, 1-0 or 2-1, all the time. They don't show any brilliancy but they win all the events. The Russians may win their other matches 8-1 or 10-2 but they will lose 0-1 against the Czechs in the final. Then nobody cares any longer how much the Russians scored in previous matches because in the decisive match they are helpless. The Czechs have a very solid defence. In fact there are some parallels with chess. They have a brilliant goalkeeper. In chess this is the last barrier, when you are on an edge of losing, but you sense very well where exactly this edge is. And then you go on the counterattack. Their strategy is so clear. They have been doing this for two or three years and nobody can do anything. This idea occurred to me when they won another championship in May and I had already signed the contract to play Garry, I thought, okay, it's a different game but the approach is very interesting. And that's how I chose this defensive approach. You need to be sure that you will be strong enough to hold. If you are not sure that you can hold worse positions, this approach makes no sense. I had been defending all these Petroffs, which I hated, but it proved very useful. It's no accident that I lost so rarely, because I got really aware of this final edge."

Posted by: acirce at October 13, 2006 18:08

I do not think there is any prospect at all of Kramnik playing in Mexico and putting his title on the line in a tournament. This is not how he has won or defended the world title over these past 6 years and it is not how he is going to lose it. It is surpising that anyone seriously thinks he would. The prospect of FIDE "stripping" him of his title would ,I imagine, be of no concern. Even if this occurs there will be money for a match involving Kramnik so it will not make much difference.

As for Toppys blunders they arose becuase of the position Kramnik put him in - no other chess player is capable of putting Topalov in these situations which is why I believe he would have beaten anyone else. So I think its artificail to regard the Toppys mistakes in isolation as if he was a computer that had a temporary power failure because of the weather. Moreover putting the mistakes together as "horrendous blunders" is over simplifying. Each move had its own context and was quite different. For example the first game Toppy lost he missed a move that neither player saw - although Toppy saw the drawing line that Kram missed. In his 2nd loss I think he was stunned by Kramniks resistence and one move in particular - he had perhaps one drawing resource and blanked. His 3rd loss he was under pressure and perhaps fell victim to his strategy of keeping Kram at the table. So its not really 3 mad blunders gave 3 Kram victories. In each case Krams play was a key factor in creating the situation.

Posted by: Andy at October 13, 2006 18:09

Heaven forfend that Kramnik should defend his title in a tournament!
A disgusting idea.

Posted by: Charles Milton Ling at October 13, 2006 18:13

Congratulations, David Quinn. Your notion that Kramnik 'refused Leko a rematch' represents a new bitch about him, one which I have not previously heard even from Hungarians. This is a milestone.

But are you not missing something? My computer gives the final Rxb7+ instantly. This move is not easy for a human to see, as we can see from the fact Topalov missed it. It seems pretty clear to me that this move must have been signalled to Kramnik.

I bet you're still telling your mates about that ....Bc5-b4. 'There was this bloke on the internet who claimed it was to force the trade of knights, said he was 2400 but he bet he wasn't. Posted some link to notes he said were by Svidler but they weren't signed - anyway Svidler's another Russki - still looks like a computer move to me......'.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 18:28

thank you, Mig, for the great job you did here.

Posted by: Ellrond at October 13, 2006 18:29

Congratulations to Kramnik! The tiebreaks really don't mean anythign to me (other than to say no point in playing game 5 now) but I'm glad this is settled to everyones satisfaction.

As far as who played the better chess I really have no business saying one way or another. (althoguh that doesn't stop me)

But I am curious from opinions from those who are more in the know. Obviously strong players who looked at this with a computer would be able to give some good input.

The horrendous double blunders of game 2 overshadow the rest of the game. But after the double blunder of game 2 didn't Topalov still have an advantage?

Didn't that advantage slowly crumble away and lead to an advantage to black as Kramnik outplayed Topalov? Yes there were key moves missed by Topalov like Qh5 and a few other ways later to perhaps save the game but is it fair to say not playing them were blunders? Would missing moves like Qh5 and perhaps other chances to save the game not occur in typical WC match games? No they did not play perfect chess but now that we all have 2800 pcs is every imperfection a blunder?

Also, yes Krmanik seemed on the defense allot but he also had black for 6 of the 11 games.

I can't judge this other than by what the computer tells me but it seems like Kramnik impoved his position relative to Topalov over a series of say 10 moves as often as Topalov did the same.

I guess opinions on this are really just too subjective.

Posted by: niceforkinmove at October 13, 2006 18:30

I dont think its a disgusting idea I just think it wont happen. How about this which world chess champion having won their title in a match defended it in a tournament? Ok I've got it - none of them. Or try this does anyone imagine Kasparov would have agreed to defend his title in a tournament? Yep I can answer that too - no. If you dont have the world title then I suppose a tournament seems fine it seems obvious that when you have won it by playing one or more tough matches you feel differently.

Posted by: Andy at October 13, 2006 18:30

rdh you said it not me about Rxb7+ . Someone (you?) gave a good explanation of Bc5-b4-c5, thanks for that and once I understood it I stopped asking. Nobody has yet explained the mysterious rook moves 22-25 in game 12 which I asked about right after the game, but it's only been a day. Please watch your language by the way, aren't you even happy today?

The FIDE title is what Kramnik won today. That title is going to be contested again in a tournament in 2007 and as a free man it's Kramnik's decision whether to compete there.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 18:45

Kramnik plays very similar style to the Italian soccer. Many hate them for that, but I find them fascinating -- they can defend and they can score too (particularly when needed).

Topalov needs more balance in my opinion. There's no point to pretend to be Zoro all the time. I think he will learn from that experience, particularly after getting humbled by someone who didn't crack under his bravado.

Kramnik, I think defined his image in this match as more than a closet character -- this was the impression I got from peeking into various forums before the game.

Anyway, so long, until it gets interesting again. At least we pulled the old dusty chess set out of the closet and my son is hooked...

D.

Posted by: Dimi at October 13, 2006 18:45

It seems the notion of winning the WC title through a tournament has become acceptable. Think back to 1993, no one could have imagined having anytype of tournament choose the WC. It just didn't make sense.

Unfortunately all these FIDE knock-out events have watered down the meaning of the title and somehow made it seem like an acceptable means of determining the world champion. But it isn't.

If Kramnik has to break away from FIDE again, so be it.

Posted by: Ellsworth Toohey at October 13, 2006 18:46

Azmai and Makropoulos were responsible for screwing over Kramnik. Once Kirsan got back to Elista he did his best to pick up the pieces. (Replaced the appeals committee, tried to negotiate a 14 or 16-game match, and evidently stuck a sock in Danailov's piehole.)

Chess' long-time problem was that Kasparov and Kirsan didn't need each other to accomplish their individual objectives.

But Kramnik's life would be easier under a Kok-lead WCC structure. And Kirsan is likely tired of the managing the chessmess and might take pride in putting chess back on a reliable footing.

Kirsan will work out a compromise to keep Kramnik on the ranch.


Posted by: greg koster at October 13, 2006 18:47

Well put, Stern. You are looking at the whole picture. Andy's comments about blunders help explain what I'm getting at.

"I think you misunderstand what people are saying. It's simply a fact that his wins were achieved primarily through through his opponent's rather severe blunders."

I look at it from both sides. Why not say Topalov's blunders were achieved primarily as a result of Kramnik's moves? The moves are not made in isolation one from the other, the gestalt of the situation produces whatever happens. I'm not saying kramniks moves were so amazing they forced Topalov's blunders just that calling Topalov's mistakes more of a factor than Kramnik's moves that preceded and followed is to impose a bias. There's the whole match situation and what happens within that. this includes the players styles and whether or not they execute well. Stern presented it well:

"a highly tactical style is inherently prone to the ‘big turnover’ (blunders), so when it happens you cannot just discount it as an outlier result, but rather must incorporate its chances of happening into calculating whether or not Topalov is a better player."

It's not a matter of "would have, could have, should have." It's just a matter of being honest about how Kramnik's wins came about."

I think its a matter of seeing the whole situation and observing who came out better. By every measure in this match Kramnik was better. Ruslan points out all the other ways Kramnik's results support his claim to being better. The only way Topalov can prove otherwise is to beat him in a match.

I have no love for Kramnik whose style is not my favorite; I think I was rooting for Topalov as the match started. I was annoyed at the off the board tactics-especially as they suddenly arose when he was down by 2- but this is also part of all WC matches to some degree and I was impressed that Kramnik still prevailed as his stamina was supposed to be a weak point. I just don't think we should make excuses or somehow diminish his achievemet becasue of some weighting that implies your blunders don't mean you suck, only your good moves mean you're good.

Posted by: Mduchamp at October 13, 2006 18:47

Dimi my 5 year old now says "I like chess!". He didn't say that before the match.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 18:48

Ruslan, Stern, thanks for those posts! :o)

Posted by: Albrecht von der Lieth at October 13, 2006 18:49

I agree, Dimi. Topalov should learn from this, just like Kramnik did from losing to Shirov in 1998, and modulate his style. Although will he need to, if he thinks from now on the title will be won in super-tournaments, where it's all a matter of making a good score against Moro and Judit Polgar and the like?

nikeforkinmove: indeed. Kramnik didn't win game 2 because of a blunder. He won it because he played better.

DQ: sure I'm happy but I'm tired of you guys not giving Kramnik credit and saying dumb things. Knock it off for a week or so, why not?

Speaking of credit, Topalov fought very bravely in this match on the board, shared the credit for making it a magnificent fight and would have emerged with an awful lot of admiration and goodwill were it not for you-know-what. It would be fascinating to know what he really thinks when he gets home in a week's time, sits down and really thinks about it. I suspect the answer is - nothing at all; his manager did great, everything was great, and if only he'd not played that 24...f6 everything would have been fine. I have the impression he's surrounded by enough sycophants, and spends enough time talking to children and having people think he's wonderful, that he has no real need to care what the world thinks of him at all.

Posted by: rdh at October 13, 2006 19:05

rdh I did give Kramnik credit, said he's a brilliant player and the FIDE champion, that he won according to the rules. What more would you want, please be specific.

We agree that we just saw a great match between two great opponents.

I think Topalov has little support and no infrastructure behind him. I don't even detect any support from the Bulgarian government. Kramnik has more support than that. Sycophants? Please tell me what you're referring to, I don't understand. If the public likes him, well there's nothing wrong with that, either for him or for the sport of chess.

Posted by: David Quinn at October 13, 2006 19:15

"Why not say Topalov's blunders were achieved primarily as a result of Kramnik's moves?"

lol surely this comes right out of (WC)C Krapniks own private toilet...

Posted by: poisoned pawn at October 13, 2006 19:26

I congratulate Kramnik for winning this match. Thanks to Garry Kasparov, Kramnik has achieved a great status in the chess world. Why thanks to Kasparov? Because he proposed him the opportunity to play a match he didn't earn in his own right. He won it and now there is no legitimate way to put him down of the throne he has successfully defended.

Think in this situation -apologies for its inaccuracy- Suppose all of a sudden, a boss decided to give to some person the chance to be the CEO of the company he owns; maybe he didn't showed to be the most capable employee, but he was certainly one of the best, the boss appreciate his qualities and he was lucky enough that the circunstances were favourable in a specific moment. Others are skeptical and believe they deserve the position more than him, but he manage to hold it. They try to show in a direct confrontation they are better, but they can't and of course, as a new leader:

- He is getting some experience and knowledge the others lack for being in the new position
- After being in this position, he would be afraid of participating in any open competition of merits that involve a big group and he would reject any offer to do that.

Of course, to be able to do that, he certainly needs understanding, equilibruim and coldness to hold the most ferocious attacks; his strength would be to take advantage of the necessity others have to reach the top... Kramnik has shown these qualities.

He might not be the #1 rated player in the world, but he was lucky enough to shine in the precise moment six years ago; sounds unfair to others, but I guess a essential key of success in life consist of taking advantage of chances you got. Kramnik has done that in chess.

My only wish is that given the circunstances he got his position, he might try to give something back to chess. What? A sense of coherence as a leader, coherence that has been missing a long time ago. How? By not using his title for his own self indulgence and think in the chess world instead.

What I criticize about Topalov's team was his lack of equilibruim (consistent with the playing style and the human being) and lack of experience and how they consider the title important enough than their own reputation. I hope they will recover and get a second chance. Kramnik in the past was not the best leader (delayed rematch against Kasparov until it was virtually impossible to do that), but this experience today and the way he won might give him insight.

Chess is an extremely aggresive sport, unfortunately associated with many stereotypes. He see that in the posts here and not even the managers and promoters can control their behavior.


Imagine when you won a title, of course, people is trying to reach the top and became sometimes dominated by their own insecurities: Kasparov claims on how Kramnik didn't defend his title against him are like the typical fight: "You need to fight against me, now ... or maybe you are a chicken? Chicken, chicken ... I am better than you, I know you don't want to fight because you are afraid, bla bla bla" . So, in such a world, if nobody is really dominant in the sport, I would root for the players that bring a sense of equilibruim, that are able to slow down the pace, even at the cost of not caring too much in other's provocations. Kramnik is one of these players (Anand might be other).

Congrats to him.


Posted by: Sandorchess at October 13, 2006 20:00

Superb posts on this column!

Today the world's best match player finally defeated the world's best (active) tournament player.

Even though Topalov's style is considerably more exciting to watch from the vantage of a club player, I am grateful that Kramnik won the Unified title, regardless of the Game 5 stain on Topalov's character reputation.

I took Kasparov's side in 1993, believing the true world champion had more authority over his playing conditions than FIDE would permit him. With no sympathy for FIDE's political scheming, I developed a true disdain for the petty powerbrokers at FIDE, a disdain which carried over for the second-rate "world champions" that they paraded around like puppets.

Granted, each played a great tournament, and understood chess at a level I can never touch, but what an enormous gap between Khalifman, Kasimdzhanov and Kasparov. I felt embarrassed for FIDE and embarrassed for my favorite sport.

When Anand won the FIDE title I finally felt compelled to validate the title; not that Anand was better than Kasparov, but because he was the first FIDE champion who was arguably equal to Kasparov at the time -- and a dignified and likeable human being as well. When Topalov won last year, and then became rated #1 in the world, the FIDE title finally held some real weight in my opinion and that of many others (most notably Kasparov).

If Topalov had won this match, it would have validated the entire FIDE championship lineage, including the players who were clearly nowhere near Kasparov while Kasparov was active. What was at stake here was the FIDE lineage vs. the Classical lineage, and the Classical lineage prevailed. In support of the great tradition of one-on-one matches for the world title, I have favored Kramnik since before the match.

It is my sincere hope that Kramnik does not participate in Mexico City tounament because that would mean capitulating to FIDE and abandoning the classical tradition. Let it serve as a "candidates" tournament that determines Kramnik's next opponent.

Posted by: Damian Nash at October 13, 2006 20:11

Annuntio vobis gaudium magnum:
Habemus Papam!
Eminentissimum ac reverendissimum Dominum,
Dominum VLADIMIR
Caissa Cardinalem KRAMNIK,
Qui sibi nomen imposuit WORLD CHESS CHAMPION XIV

Posted by: zero@ego.com at October 13, 2006 20:28

meant to say:

Anand was arguably equal to Kasparov ***and/or Kramnik*** in 2000 when he won the FIDE title...

Posted by: Damian Nash at October 13, 2006 20:28

First, the obligatory congrats and thanks - to Kramnik and to Mig and Susan Polgar's blogs, without whom I wouldn't be able to follow the match because of that horrendously slow Chessbase server. I just may sign up the Ninja newsletter.

Second, any thanks Kramnik should provide to Kasparov were probably delivered in 2000 when he offered Vlad the chance to play after Shirov couldn't close the deal and Anand had conflicts. I'm not sure Garry thanked him after the match is over.

Finally, this may be off the mark for most of the posters here, but I find Kramnik's play inspiring (yes, I do). Defensive play is an art, but it's not only about protection - I find him more of a counterpuncher: waiting for weaknesses and opportunity and then striking when the opponent over-extends himself.

As Dan Heisman said (yes, I'm a patzer), when you get an advantage, think defense first (Pernell Whitaker for you boxing fans)! For Kramnik, I think he does the reverse: play defensively and then press for an advantage at the first sign of an opening. With Topalov's go-for-it style of sacs and constant pressing forward, while exiting for the viewers, this was tailor-made for Vlad.

To me, to consistently draw with Black and draw/win with White means you will win and I don't see anything wrong with that and is the perfect strategy in a match knowing you'll get alternating White and Black. Given that he was screwed out of a White on Game 5 and had to play 3 consecutive Blacks starting with Game 6, it makes his victory even more impressive.

I think there's a lot to learn from Kramnik's play: make no wild sacs, make no bad moves and when your opponent shows a weakness, jump on it and step on his throat. We can't all be Tal, Kasparov or Topalov; Kramnik's style might be easier to follow/learn for the majority of us!

Kramnik has nothing to prove by playing in tourney in Mexico. He united the title in a Match, he should only be able to lose it (or put it on the line) in a match.

Should he worry about an 8-man tourney in Mexico when they haven't even set the Candidates Matches yet? The only way that 8-man tourney means anything is if the winner meets Kramnik in match for all the marbles. I do think that Topalov should be in tha final 8. In the old format of Candidates matches, wasn't the PREVIOUS World Champion already seeded into the Candidates matches?

Posted by: drummer at October 13, 2006 20:39

Sandorchess, I believe you're rather unfair to Kramnik in your previous post. Except for Shirov, who really got screwed by the whole cancelled-match unfair, which other player in the world in 2000 was more worthy than Kramnik to face Kasparov in a title contest ? Only Anand had a tournament record the equal of Kramnik's at that point, and he had already gotten his chance before while showing no interest in taking up Kasparov's offer to play in 2000. So, who was left ? Topalov, Kamsky, Moro, Ivanchuk, Svidler, Leko ? All of them combined couldn't match Kramnik's victories in super-tournaments up to that point. It's not as if he was somehow produced by Kasparov out of nothing, and besides Shirov I can't recall any other contender voicing displeasure with Kasparov's selection of a challenger. So, your comparison to an office situation where 'an employee who hadn't proven his superiority over his coworkers got the promotion ' is completely mistaken.

But I agree that Kramnik owed both Garry and all chess fans a rematch.

Posted by: Voluminous at October 13, 2006 20:43

Dear Vladimir Kramnik,

Congratulations !!! You set good standards despite lot of odds against you and came out a winner. Keep up the good work!

Dear Topalov,

Please accept this defeat with dignity and make amendments in your team to get the worldwide recognition you deserve. People do make mistakes at times. I want you to try hard next time.

Kris Knight

Posted by: Kris Knight at October 13, 2006 21:01

It's too bad that many of today's players (and blogposters) weren't yet around during the "golden age" of Zonals, Interzonals, and Candidates Matches. They were fantastic. The winner (who thereby became the official challenger against the world champion) had to have survived the toughest tournaments and the toughest matches.

I say: bring back the Interzonals and Candidates Matches!

Posted by: ComputoJon at October 13, 2006 21:14

Congrats to Kramnik for being the WC Champion.

Congrats to Topalov for sticking to playing attacking chess.

Congrats to Danailov for making this event more interesting.

Thanks to Mig for this great forum.

Posted by: tsn at October 13, 2006 21:19

"congrats to danailov for making this event even more interesting".

Was it humor?

Posted by: ruslan at October 13, 2006 22:24

Silvio Danailov is so quiet all of a sudden

Posted by: Stefan Teplan at October 13, 2006 22:31

Write to Kramnik or Topalov through Chessbase:

http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=3424

ComputoJon,

I remember those days, and that was when 4 years separated title defenses, wasn't it? I remember Fischer buzzing through Taimanov, Larsen, then Petrosian, winning an unbelievable 13 games IN A ROW! Think about that for just a minute and put it in perspective...

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 22:36

Write to Kramnik or Topalov through Chessbase:

http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=3424

ComputoJon,

I remember those days, and that was when 4 years separated title defenses, wasn't it? I remember Fischer buzzing through Taimanov, Larsen, then Petrosian, winning an unbelievable 13 games IN A ROW! Think about that for just a minute and put it in perspective...

http://chess-training.blogspot.com

Posted by: Mark at October 13, 2006 22:36

"congrats to topalov for sticking to playing attacking chess".

Again, was it humor? I mean... can a player who chooses to play the slav with black pieces, and who accepts to play against the slav with white, can this player still be considered being "sticking to playing attacking chess" ??

Attacking players play e4 !!! What? What did I hear? Petroff? Berlin defense? No way : e4 e5, and now true attacking players play f4.

Topalov played his style in the first two games. 2-0. After such a sudden pain in the a_s, his chess was almost as quiet as Kramnik's...

Topalov first played the catalan, and was totally outplayed. Did he gave a shot to the nimzo indian, queen's indian, king's indian? Did he choosed an unbalanced structure? Nope. The slav. Probably the most boring opening variation available on a chessboard.

So please. To all those who keep saying that Topalov was playing better, just think about it : this world championship match ended up in a theoretical debate on the slav. Isn't it enough significative of how far Topalov was outplayed by Kramnik?

Posted by: ruslan at October 13, 2006 22:39

To all those who still believe that Topalov was the best player :

When Kramnik plays d4,
1) he totally demolished Kasparov's king indian systems.
2) he outplayed nearly everybody (including Topalov) on the catalan.
3) his results against the nimzo and the queen's indian are impressive.
Even Topalov "the great" had to switch to the slav in order to try to resist.

With the black pieces, Kramnik ALONE picked up a minor variation (the berlin defense) and transformed it into a weapon that annih